Rerolling! What do you think of this build (PvP I guess?)

[Daytona]

So this build would hopefully be viable in PvP. I wont have any implants until I level up and find them.

I had to raise small guns first because if I did big guns then I wouldn't have high enough skills for the ranged perks.

In the end my weapon choice would be versatile, but mostly big guns (Not really interested in anything over 41 range). Perception is at 6 so with 7 I can see max range for rockets. I guess I'll have to wait for a str implant to use the heavier guns.

Qs:
1. Is it terrible to only take two lifegivers?

2. If I went with 9END and used the END implant at level 24, do I get retroactive health?

3. Is stonewall very essential for PvP?

[Kaaon]

- its not good to combine criticals and RL - so first of all you should decide between crit burster or RL tank
crits doesnt do much for RL while RL needs much more PE then 6-7
range of rocket launcher is 40 hex but real range is much higher, by using hexshooting to last hex of your range you can hit enemies up to 43 hexes from you
you can also have +2 range bonus on your RL which is main bonus to look for RL, so that total max range of 45 hexes .. 7 pe = 41 hex - thats 4 less then your max range
8 pe = 44 hex - still not enough
9 pe = 47 hex - thats a good FoV for RL because its also always good to see enemy and be prepared before he comes to your FoV
good RL tank for pvp does have 10 base PE - 2 psycho +1 cigs = 9 pe drugged

- you want a BG, for BG its not worth to take better criticals, it gives almost nothing for burst damage or rockets, its worth only for aimshots

- take 7 or 9 AG so you can have 8 or 10 with nuka cola

- always use cigs, nukacola and for BG also psycho in pvp

- you lose -20 skill for each missing ST compared to ST requirement but that can be fixed with high weapon skill so 6 ST is only needed for stonewall, 5 ST for adrenaline rush, for other builds you should be fine with 1 ST and 300% weapon skill so you really dont need ST implant

- implants are very rare, dont count on them

- traits are fine

- 100 doctor is like requirement for pvp in case of getting crippled, to instantly heal your cripple instead of spamming your teammates and wasting your and their time during battle

1. Is it terrible to only take two lifegivers?
- no its fine, 3rd one is not much worth it atm, most of ppl prefer brof/mos over 3rd LG

2. If I went with 9END and used the END implant at level 24, do I get retroactive health?
- no

3. Is stonewall very essential for PvP?
- its nearly must have for RL/gatling tanks, for others not really

[Daytona]

Thanks for all the info seki!
But why doesn't crit matter for rockets and bursting? Isn't it still important to crit?
Is it because of high chance to crit already?
Is better criticals still good for them?


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[Kaaon]

But why doesn't crit matter for rockets and bursting? Isn't it still important to crit?
Is it because of high chance to crit already?
Is better criticals still good for them?

uh, this is hard to explain..  its all because of how critical hit table works
http://forum.fonline-reloaded.net/index.php?topic=1708.msg36603#msg36603

as you can see unaimed shots (like RL) do only 1,5x damage on crit while 23% crit chance will after hidden modifier and armor crit mod result in only about 17% crit chance which is not much
for RL its also more important to get other perks like quick pockets, brof, stonewall and tanky perks

bursts are very good with criticals, they are counted as torso so they do 3 - 3,5x damage on crit, thats alot and crit chance is counted per bullet so you often crit at least few bullets in burst instead of hoping for crit as with single shot weapons
critroll (better criticals) is not much worth for bursting since all parts of torso crit table are almost same - its mostly 3x or 3,5x damage and KD at all rolls while for aimedshots they do much more

[Daytona]

Ah I see. Since BC is +20 at best (wiki says it's a %) and everyone probably has MoS it's not gonna help much unless you really want a chance at those 6th tier crit
I guess I'll drop one from luck, put it into pe and get rid of BC... Probably get stonewall instead


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[Fun Fest]

bursts are very good with criticals, they are counted as torso so they do 3 - 3,5x damage on crit, thats alot and crit chance is counted per bullet so you often crit at least few bullets in burst instead of hoping for crit as with single shot weapons
critroll (better criticals) is not much worth for bursting since all parts of torso crit table are almost same - its mostly 3x or 3,5x damage and KD at all rolls while for aimedshots they do much more

You don't crit per bullet; the entire burst crits. Burst crits use the "unaimed" section.

Better Criticals is quite nice for crit bursters. Normally, 80% of your burst crits will do 1.5x damage and 20% will do 2x damage + KD (vs a guy wearing CA). With Better Criticals, 60% will be 1.5x damage, 30% will be 2x damage + KD, and 10% will be 2x damage + KO, according to the critical table.

I wouldn't recommend Stonewall on a crit burster due to its huge stat requirement, which takes away from your LK.

[Rinzler]

My understanding is there is an initial roll which, if successful makes 80% of the burst critical and causes a 'critical hit' message, a roll is then done for the remaining 20%. If the initial roll fails then each bullet is rolled individually, no 'critical' message is displayed but damage is increased accordingly for each critical bullet.

[Kaaon]

You don't crit per bullet; the entire burst crits. Burst crits use the "unaimed" section.

- burst criticals are counted per bullet (its not like whole burst is crit or nothing)
- there is only one crit roll applied to whole burst
- critical effects like KD and KO are applied and chat message shown only if at least 80% of bullets was critical (so some of bullets can be critical even if there is no crit in chat)
- bursts counts as torso in crit table, not unaimed

Better Criticals is quite nice for crit bursters. Normally, 80% of your burst crits will do 1.5x damage and 20% will do 2x damage + KD (vs a guy wearing CA). With Better Criticals, 60% will be 1.5x damage, 30% will be 2x damage + KD, and 10% will be 2x damage + KO, according to the critical table.

- since you need 80%+ bullets to be crit to get crit effects like KD or KO and there is -crit mod on armor, KO from bursts is very rare and its not worth to count on it
- damage boost of 3x to 3,5x is not big and since its only at 51-70 -> 71-90, there is only 20% chance to get any profit from it

edit : not sure now if burst is torso or uncalled, sry

[Fun Fest]

My understanding is there is an initial roll which, if successful makes 80% of the burst critical and causes a 'critical hit' message, a roll is then done for the remaining 20%. If the initial roll fails then each bullet is rolled individually, no 'critical' message is displayed but damage is increased accordingly for each critical bullet.

I took a look at the old source code, and this seems to be the case, though only 70% of bullets are checked for crit if the initial crit roll fails. (Not that any mortal can actually understand what's going on in combat.fos)

[Daytona]

My understanding is there is an initial roll which, if successful makes 80% of the burst critical and causes a 'critical hit' message, a roll is then done for the remaining 20%. If the initial roll fails then each bullet is rolled individually, no 'critical' message is displayed but damage is increased accordingly for each critical bullet.

I took a look at the old source code, and this seems to be the case, though only 70% of bullets are checked for crit if the initial crit roll fails. (Not that any mortal can actually understand what's going on in combat.fos)

Where can I find recent reloaded source code?

[Kaaon]

Where can I find recent reloaded source code?

http://forum.fonline-reloaded.net/index.php?topic=7505.0

[Daytona]

Where can I find recent reloaded source code?

http://forum.fonline-reloaded.net/index.php?topic=7505.0

Thanks! I might have to set up a server to try and contribute some content eventually.

[Daytona]

Ok I've decided on most of my build, with the exception of my final perk.

I'm torn between even tougher, lifegiver 3, better criticals. and BRD.

Q1: Does BRD add damage per bullet of a burst? It's useless for rockets right?

Below is a screen of what I have so far. It's similar to the OP, except in my OP I actually skipped a perk.. so got stonewall.

I know we discussed better criticals, but I think extra damage still might be the way to go. However that extra 10% DR is almost a permanent psycho and most people are minigunners =\

thanks!

[Nick]

yeah, BRD gives per bullet

[Fun Fest]

Your build is pretty odd. I've never seen anyone try to combine Stonewall with crits. If you plan to use a Rocket Launcher, you'll want Quick Pockets for 1 AP reloading. I wonder, though, can you even crit when hex shooting?

Your build would work fine with a Gatling Laser. Get Even Tougher or Adrenaline Rush if you plan on using Psycho with no Jet (which I'm assuming since you took Stonewall, though your PE would be pretty low).