Some perks idea

[abysse]

Hey ! i'd suggest giving snipers some love, it's why i'll suggest sharpshooter negating "all" the critical chance ( not modifier ) except the crafted critical chances  on it, meaning there's a maximum of -5 critical chance on them ( if crafted this way ), such buff could give snipers more stats variation ( like 8 luck or even 7 )

On top of that i think a more punishing ST check on weapon is required :

"Deduct 20% for each point of ST missing to use the weapon properly." = Probably a real mess to code right ?

i'd change it like this : 15% for pistols, 30% for two handed and 45% for heavy weapons

"Weapon handling" giving actually 2 virtual strenght for weapons, i'd make it +3

If you have some idea feel free. i'd higly appreciate a GM though on those, thanks for reading and sorry for my english ;p

[Perteks]

I don't see any positive things from those changes.

[abysse]

There's a thread about how much snipers are useless and for a reason : and i'll suggest using this one to debate if needed

I'm not sure why you don't see any positive thing, you played sniper recently ? how it's going ? i don't mind your post but please construct it

I do realise how they are hard to balance since there's the random factor, it's either too strong or too weak most of time, and actually it's too randomly weak.

[Seki]

Hey ! i'd suggest giving snipers some love, it's why i'll suggest sharpshooter negating "all" the critical chance ( not modifier ) except the crafted critical chances  on it, meaning there's a maximum of -5 critical chance on them ( if crafted this way ), such buff could give snipers more stats variation ( like 8 luck or even 7 )

On top of that i think a more punishing ST check on weapon is required :

"Deduct 20% for each point of ST missing to use the weapon properly." = Probably a real mess to code right ?

i'd change it like this : 15% for pistols, 30% for two handed and 45% for heavy weapons

"Weapon handling" giving actually 2 virtual strenght for weapons, i'd make it +3

If you have some idea feel free. i'd higly appreciate a GM though on those, thanks for reading and sorry for my english ;p

sharpshooter and weapon handling are by far two most powerful perks for sniper already, making them even stronger would be really stupid
you dont even give any reasoning behind changes you suggest

now lets do some math 

about weapon handling.. most of snipers use jet and 1 base ST, sniper which cannot shoot twice in a row is losing alot of potential.. and to get enough hit chance to hit eyes at max range you need like 3 ST (or 2 and accuracy rifle)
going from 1 ST after jet (-1) to 3 ST costs 4 special points (if you get them through perks, drugs or investing special points.. its up to you but its still value of 4 special points for which you need to sacrifice something, generally 1 perk is around 2 special point value)
by taking weapon handling you only sacrifice more criticals which gives 5 crit chance and thats value of less then 2 SPECIAL points assuming you aim eyes(1 lk is over 3% crit to eyes)
so its basically trade of less then 2 special point value of perk for 4 special point value of perk
with weapon handling you dont need to rely on accuracy rifles or use buffout/psycho/st armor/whatever, its a great perk as it is now after AC changes.. especially combined with finesse which negates more crits lose, with finesse you will have more then enough crit chance anyways even without more crits
tldr.. if you would have to choose between more crit and weapon handling, weapon handling is already obvious choice so it doesnt need boost

then you can also compare weapon handling to gain strength.. while at first look seems to be very similar but they arent really
-weapon handling can be taken on level 3, while gain at level 12
-weapon handling allows you to do what i said above, to go from 1 (-1) to 3 ST for hit chance purposes while gain ST doesnt
on the other side..
-gain strength gives other benefits then just hit chance
so its pretty balanced..

about sharpshooter.. i hope we can skip that discussion, its literally 3 perks in 1 now, how can you say its not enough ? 

i dont think that snipers need more love.. sure, removed smallframe and AC changes are really bad for snipers but they got some really big buffs which are not obvious at first look but they are there, i will explain into details later in other topic once i find time to write it..

[abysse]

Thanks it's the answer size i expected ( and wanted ) i sadly can't give the same level of answer.

It's only my view but 1 str sniper bugs me i don't know why we can still do that ( my suggestion about strenght check )

my suggestions are mainly centered around sharpshooter : the perk is OP when we think about it but a single helmet counter a whole build efficiency while there's almost not a single thing to counter burst, except being a burster too.

After many test on a 1 luck character with bonehead, i'm truly scared there's too many no critical hit and low rolls ones ( and again the random factor complicate it all both for small fights ( 1 vs 1/2 vs 2 ect  ) and larges scales ( TC ) i do realise if we touch snipers in efficiency we quickly get buils able to kill almost anything without being even seen wich is more unhealty than the current situation, i tried to give a few cents to improve the current meta. but i'm out of idea for now

[swinglinered]

there's almost not a single thing to counter burst, except being a burster too.

Maybe a "Walk Between The Raindrops" Perk or Support Perk that doubles AC vs bullets in a burst, but not vs single shots.

Or have the Psychic Nullifier grant In Your Face at all ranges. But that would screw snipers even more.

[abysse]

Yep exactly, the balance is strugling a lot for this reason : giving a defense perk to snipers against burst : burster could use it too and the situation will get even worse

i'm still thinking about a way to make snipers actually "viable" since they get instantly killed in most situation, i just had in mind a defense perk : if we can manage to get a support perk that can be stricly applied to sniper rifles users : "When you get hit you're nstantly sneaked for 3 seconds ( has 20 sec  cooldown "disabled in TC area?" sniper/laser rifle in hand required

That kind of defense system could aslo be toxic : A sniper sneaker could use this to sneak shoot : get fired at have the "defense" effect and sneak on top of it : the perk must trigger a sneak cooldown like 10 secs

We could also use a shortcut to trigger this perk manually at the cost of twice the cooldown like 4 sneak duration if you're hit 20 second cooldown and 2 second sneak duration activated 40 sec cooldown

Not gonna lie i'm really proud of this idea. except the fact it may gives issue to code it : it is possible to get "invisible like a 300% sneak without the sniper in hand malus ? can we even do that ? and make it stricly for Snipers builds ( idk how...)

It's possible to make aimed shots impossible ( fast shot ) : it must be doable to make all burst impossible with such perk i guess i solved the enigma. ( oh and also a END cap to prevent tank having it and maybe make it impossible to reacha  certain amount of HP's with this. ( Enough to suffer a single burst i'd say )

Sorry for this wall of text ! Thanks if you read it all, and sorry i do realise my english still need improvements.

[POWERPUFF]

what the? Snipers get insta killed? Then you have a really bad build. They crit & bypass alot, snipers are much more better than in season2, that's the reason you don't see only tanks & bursters on TC.

To be honest it's good as it is now.

Btw bursters get killed in two bursts from another bursters too (not from tanks though), do you plan to improve this as well?

Not sure why this is to be ruined again, snipers are supposed to be weaker in terms of defense. Tanks & bursters are there to do the dirty job, also healers can stand next to snipers.

[abysse]

what the? Snipers get insta killed?

"since they get instantly killed in most situations" = What i wrotte

            =/=

"Since they get instantly killed" = What you read

Funny how the problem is never about the burster, it's simply "They are supposed to be weaker" meaning they should be able to kill nah ? and actually the reliability and effectiveness to kill is on the burster side. I'm not speaking about TC only, playing sniper based build is a good way to realise how inferior they are compared to anything else, eye shot for 20 damages, stupid tesla helmet VS Ew weapons, the 50% bypass nerf while burster do even more damages now. we keep saying they get buffs while burster also got some nasty buff too. It's like planting some tree while burning the grows ones : turning in circle.

[POWERPUFF]

Eye shots for 20dmg?

Man get your things straight up, you must be running the worst sniper build ever.

If you ever played TC you'd see how powerful snipers are.

Last season you peaked without any fear, this season you rather don't peak unless you're a full tank and sniper won't KO & bypass you for 1/2 of your HP instantly.

This is just a "oh plz god im getting killed, boost me" kind of topic again.

[abysse]

I had interessting answer until now, you're about to use the "bad builds points every post you make ? how do you even fail a sniper build ?

to stay serious i'm mostly pointing out how much disadvantage you have simly by playing a sniper.


And yes the 20 dmg is a real thing while a burster has a 100% reliable dps it's what i'm saying since the beginning in fact :p

( The random factor )

After all this you have a point of view about the defense system i'm thinking about ? don't worry this one won't touche the TC )

[POWERPUFF]

Don't try to fix what is not broken.

Man, there are no 20dmg crits into eyes, unless you're using pipe rifle for range shooting geckos.

You do not have disadvantage by playing sniper, you may have disadvantage by playing sniper like a scrub.

Snipers are good, even Seki confirmed, so what are you trying to build this on? Your personal experience, that you are not happy?

Snipers are simply weaker in defense, for fuck sake, it's logical, just get over it.

[abysse]

I like the way you pick up only what you want to answer, that's quite boring since you seems to read and answer only to break what i'm saying, again i'm speaking of a global playing experience, not only TC : here's a proof you didn't even read all my wall of text since i just asked you about the defense system and you missed it

I'm just trying to speak around  the meta of "two shot pray for a knockout or die ( sniper ) VS two click next target ( burster )

[Perteks]

Snipers have very high and reliable eye shoots damage not sure what are you trying to say

[Seki]

I'm just trying to speak around  the meta of "two shot pray for a knockout or die ( sniper ) VS two click next target ( burster )

You cant compare it like that.. it sounds like comparing 1v1 at close range assuming there is no cover around.
This is mmorpg game, balance is not focused on 1v1.
If you are dying by bursters as sniper then there is nothing wrong with game balance but with your playstyle unless you got bursted by sneaker..
There we are getting a bit into offtopic since its not suggestion anymore but discussion/help(tips)..
- As sniper you have much more range then bursters, just keep distance and you will be safe.
- In case bursters gets closer you can hide behind your teammates or around corner.
- If you have good build (220+hp) and your reaction is fast enough to manage to heal after first burst then you should survive second one too and burster will be out of AP. You dont have to always shoot when you have AP, you can save some for healing if you see that situation is dangerous.