FOnline: Reloaded
Development => Suggestions => Closed suggestions => Topic started by: Bluepanda on September 28, 2013, 12:06:50 am
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I've been running a quite a few TCs and Hinkey matches (a good number with more than 15-20 players involved in each) and it's pretty much a no-brainer that the team with more miniguns/rocket launchers generally completely destroys players on the other team with non-bigguns builds.
They've just got superior range to most other weapons, great Accuracy, great damage and leaves the players with tons of maneuverability to boot. I'm not disputing that miniguns should be amazing choices in close range combat or that rocket launchers should have great suppressing fire capabilities, but they're just invalidating every other weapon choice in the game right now.
I would suggest a variable damage falloff for the Minigun (Something like 5% reduced damage dealt for every hex past 10 or 15) and a general reduction in accuracy of the rocket launcher at ranges past 25.
They should be good at close range, but not the hands down best weapon choice for every encounter.
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Well, sniper rifles also don't degrade their damage by distance.
Nor I should see why should the weapons have lower damage by distance, I mean the rocket will still explode, right? The bullets will still continue to fly and will eventually hit something.
Its fine as it is. No need to change something that is working.
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Well, sniper rifles also don't degrade their damage by distance.
Nor I should see why should the weapons have lower damage by distance, I mean the rocket will still explode, right? The bullets will still continue to fly and will eventually hit something.
Its fine as it is. No need to change something that is working.
Define working.
If you consider working to be "Well they shoot bullets and kill targets" then yes indeed they are working. But if you consider the greater goal of facilitating and endorsing balanced pvp, then i'm afraid they are very very broken.
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Well after all they gotta get somewhat close because low PE, Snipers got the advantage of crippling them/killing them before they manage to get to the shooting range.
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Well after all they gotta get somewhat close because low PE, Snipers got the advantage of crippling them/killing them before they manage to get to the shooting range.
I would say you're absolutely misconstruing the sniper role.
In my experience as a generally well built sniper, you deal absolutely abysmal damage in comparison to almost every other character on the field. Average damage on enemy players at a range is around 30-40 tops, many times you'll be hitting for absolute pittiful damage amounts of 9-11 on fully armored players. Even critical hits deal maybe in the range of 50-90 damage.
But that's fine, the sniper role is strong in groups because it can disarm enemy players and it doesn't deal a huge amount of damage. I can see how you might have a seated dislike of them because of the crowd control mechanics they have, but i know for a fact that they are not the players killing you, nor do they deal damage even remotely comparable to a minigun at range.
Avengers easily deal 110+ Damage per attack at 35 hex, No crits.
The only other players you're fighting at that range are snipers because its the only weapon type that matches that range.
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You can't know if there is no crit and btw avenger didn't have 35 range ;p?
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Noobs with "pvp" experience :) are allways funny :) take your shotgun p90 laser pistol spammer build out of tc. Most unbalanced weapon is xl.
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Jacky and his bullshit, XL comparing to avanger is good right now. Less power in damage but little faster
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For me xl and av are to strong.
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>For you
>For everybody
>BGers are still OP and must-appear on TC
>You'll nerf Avenger? Well, whatever, we'll find another BG that will be EVERYWHERE!
>Finally a little higher chance of kill on TC for SGers
>Still XL's magazine capacity is imba
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Yes make everything be a watergun. Its good right now, remember when implants will be ingame that theoretically everyone can have more hp and little more resistant.
Right now its good, just problem is that everything is soo ease to get that you don't see anything less than best stuff + sometimes rare stuff.
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Perteks my problem is av crit burst can kill almost everyone because it deal +280dmg and 1hex from xl can kill everyone except psyho tanks in ca mk2 and this is fucking assault rifle 15bullets. +25% min/max av with 3xbrd is just weapon of destruction and even vindi is weaker. I am not supporter or Nerfing because noobs are dieing but those weapons in MY opinion are 10% to strong.
When av were to weak I made post to give them more love. They got 25% boost and now they are bit to strong, there is no point to wear ma mk2 because av will rape you in 2bursts. For me perfect balance is when you have to choose between ca mk2 or ma mk2 but now all you need is ca mk2.
Same situation with xl sneaker, every sniper in tesla is dead, before snipers had to be aware of Gatling sneakers but now xl are much more powerful
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Noobs with "pvp" experience :) are allways funny :) take your shotgun p90 laser pistol spammer build out of tc. Most unbalanced weapon is xl.
I think your penchant towards insulting people instead of addressing the argument kind of screams everyone's favorite logical fallacy doesn't it?
Either way, the two are not mutually exclusive.
The XL also has a very long (35 hex) burst range and i don't doubt it would just quickly take the spot of the Avenger if it was nerfed. The range of the XL could just as easily be brought down to 25/30ish as well.
As for the strength of the XL and Avenger at 1hex, i don't have any suggestions for those, i think that would be something to address after the range is reduced ideally.
Perteks my problem is av crit burst can kill almost everyone because it deal +280dmg and 1hex from xl can kill everyone except psyho tanks in ca mk2 and this is fucking assault rifle 15bullets. +25% min/max av with 3xbrd is just weapon of destruction and even vindi is weaker. I am not supporter or Nerfing because noobs are dieing but those weapons in MY opinion are 10% to strong.
When av were to weak I made post to give them more love. They got 25% boost and now they are bit to strong, there is no point to wear ma mk2 because av will rape you in 2bursts. For me perfect balance is when you have to choose between ca mk2 or ma mk2 but now all you need is ca mk2.
Same situation with xl sneaker, every sniper in tesla is dead, before snipers had to be aware of Gatling sneakers but now xl are much more powerful
You're revolving the entire game's PVP balance around the Gatling laser and the Minigun without accounting for other weapons. That's going to end up with stale combat no matter how you balance it.
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Man me and perteks are 10000x more experienced than you and we saw many "balance". I used every possible char from sg, bg up to ew and special builds for only 1 weapon. Better play this game and after some time come back with your idea.
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I dont really know whats the point of MRD perk. 2238 devs were stupid adding that, BGers was good enought before that perk. A x3 brd av is unstoppable, and now you have to add bonuses... Btw why is av craftable? Gatling isnt and ppl still use it...
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Removing the ability for the Avenger to be crafted would be good, but it's much too late now because so many are already floating around, this change would just make the people with crafted Avengers stronger while the people without can never get them.
The solution to nerfing the Avenger shouldn't lie in crafted stats either. For starts, it needs to be reverted to 30 round bursts with damage a tick or two above the Minigun, or given walking penalty like the M60 (it certainly deserves it at this point given how hugely damaging it is).
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I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst, follow it up with a second immediate burst for 150, then I run behind cover just as fast as a dude carrying a p90. It is unmatched in damage on the battlefield.
At the moment, every time I see large scale PvP, it's pretty much just avengers, rocket launchers, and snipers. Gatling lasers are now much less of a threat than avengers, and you can actually craft avengers with mods on them.
As far as rocket launchers go, there is a reason that over half of every single TC team has them.
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The solution to nerfing the Avenger shouldn't lie in crafted stats either. For starts, it needs to be reverted to 30 round bursts with damage a tick or two above the Minigun, or given walking penalty like the M60 (it certainly deserves it at this point given how hugely damaging it is).
It's too strong, lets put it back to 30 rounds even when its actually supposed to fire 40 rounds!
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No 40 bullets is good but all what they need is just -1 or -2 dmg from single bullet
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Also, 5mm AP is OP. -35 damage resistance is crazy.
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I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst
Omg, what was the target ? Non-toughness sniper? It does 65-80 dmg on GOOD BUILD, go troll more.
If you dont want to die from bursters, make non-jet toughness char, if you want better protection against snipers - bonehead+ man of steel
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I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst
Omg, what was the target ? Non-toughness sniper? It does 65-80 dmg on GOOD BUILD, go troll more.
If you dont want to die from bursters, make non-jet toughness char, if you want better protection against snipers - bonehead+ man of steel
I guess you're saying the entire crew of BBS that just got wiped at Mariposa were BAD BUILDS. Before you even start, there was only 1 crafter, the others were PvP escorts as well as backup called in.
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Man me and perteks are 10000x more experienced than you and we saw many "balance". I used every possible char from sg, bg up to ew and special builds for only 1 weapon. Better play this game and after some time come back with your idea.
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a7/Graham%27s_Hierarchy_of_Disagreement1.svg/707px-Graham%27s_Hierarchy_of_Disagreement1.svg.png)
I offered you a chance to refute the argument. Aim for the top not the bottom.
I dont really know whats the point of MRD perk. 2238 devs were stupid adding that, BGers was good enought before that perk. A x3 brd av is unstoppable, and now you have to add bonuses... Btw why is av craftable? Gatling isnt and ppl still use it...
I don't think the perks themselves are flawed, mind you i'm arguing for a damage reduction of the miniguns at range and leaving the damage alone up close. I think they would be fairly balanced even with BRD if they were forced into close range to use them.
I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst, follow it up with a second immediate burst for 150, then I run behind cover just as fast as a dude carrying a p90. It is unmatched in damage on the battlefield.
At the moment, every time I see large scale PvP, it's pretty much just avengers, rocket launchers, and snipers. Gatling lasers are now much less of a threat than avengers, and you can actually craft avengers with mods on them.
As far as rocket launchers go, there is a reason that over half of every single TC team has them.
Same observations here; i don't mind them being a good choice. But they shouldn't be the all-around best choice.
It's too strong, lets put it back to 30 rounds even when its actually supposed to fire 40 rounds!
It doesn't matter what its "Supposed" to fire in other versions of the game. The appropriate amount of bullets to fire in a burst is completely reliant on how bullet mechanics work, how DR works and how much health the enemy players have.
In technical terms, balance.
Also, 5mm AP is OP. -35 damage resistance is crazy.
a 5mm AP change would effect a wide range of weapons. But considering the XL is close behind the minigun, it might not be a terrible idea.
I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst
Omg, what was the target ? Non-toughness sniper? It does 65-80 dmg on GOOD BUILD, go troll more.
If you dont want to die from bursters, make non-jet toughness char, if you want better protection against snipers - bonehead+ man of steel
Correction, you've just argued yourself into the circle that brought us to this mess in the first place.
A "Good Build" should not always have toughness, Man of Steel, Boneheaded, ect. What you're thinking of as a "Good" build is the typical big-guns minigun tank in combat armor with tons of health.
Don't get me wrong, i think that the tanky big guns role is a great aspect of the game. But it shouldn't dominate everything besides other tanky big guns players, and it shouldn't be the role the game is balanced around.
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I made an avenger build after this buff and I've gotta say.. it's pretty broken. I do 200+ very often on a single burst
Omg, what was the target ? Non-toughness sniper? It does 65-80 dmg on GOOD BUILD, go troll more.
Are you kidding?
I have an Adrenaline Rush, Toughness, Even Tougher, Psycho & Beer 286hp build and I still get 2-shot by Avengers in pristine CA Mk2 from max range.
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Correction, you've just argued yourself into the circle that brought us to this mess in the first place.
A "Good Build" should not always have toughness, Man of Steel, Boneheaded, ect. What you're thinking of as a "Good" build is the typical big-guns minigun tank in combat armor with tons of health.
Don't get me wrong, i think that the tanky big guns role is a great aspect of the game. But it shouldn't dominate everything besides other tanky big guns players, and it shouldn't be the role the game is balanced around.
At least i see a paper/scissors/stone system in work here. For example on "other server" BG is completely OP, you have a chance to kill them, only being doublepsychoed with at least 1 toughness. Others classes are just "supports".
For example i have awesome sneaker, which can kill combat characters. But he suck against p90 sg sneakers. What should i do ? Go whine at forum with words "nerf p90, it's op" ?
Are you kidding?
I have an Adrenaline Rush, Toughness, Even Tougher, Psycho & Beer 286hp build and I still get 2-shot by Avengers in pristine CA Mk2 from max range.
Complete lie. Already did tests, tank with 2x toughness and psycho (without jet ofc) gets 65-80 dmg from range (regular camkii vs regular ave), so go and make some test, or start to wear improved camkii vs improved avengers.
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At least i see a paper/scissors/stone system in work here. For example on "other server" BG is completely OP, you have a chance to kill them, only being doublepsychoed with at least 1 toughness. Others classes are just "supports".
For example i have awesome sneaker, which can kill combat characters. But he suck against p90 sg sneakers. What should i do ? Go whine at forum with words "nerf p90, it's op" ?
Sneaker P90 builds revolve around the burst mechanic. Are you yourself admitting BRD might be too powerful on specific weapons?
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Sneaker P90 builds revolve around the burst mechanic. Are you yourself admitting BRD might be too powerful on specific weapons?
You get me wrong. I'm trying to say that if my sneaker is using BG, he will be good against combaat chars, but he will die if will meet p90 sneaker. Stone/paper/scissors. And people ambitions to deal more damage even if they will lack in defence is blinding them, making think that there is no protection agains bursts.
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Complete lie. Already did tests, tank with 2x toughness and psycho (without jet ofc) gets 65-80 dmg from range (regular camkii vs regular ave), so go and make some test, or start to wear improved camkii vs improved avengers.
This was using a vanilla avenger against a character with toughness, even tougher, Adrenaline rush, psycho, beer, and CA Mk2. (75% DR at max health, at one point he had reached 90% DR because of Adrenaline Rush)
(http://gyazo.com/e7d5a7a7c72558b38390a988da370061.png)
This is against the same character, with (http://gyazo.com/6886a272f0a12d518239f5e400412d28.png)
(http://gyazo.com/9aa2f1a1db7d2c8c23b029eb47a63ad3.png)
Nark was a bit ahead of himself when he stated that his character could be twoshot by an avenger, though he can still be threeshot. Ignore the Manderly bit, he walked in the way.
The damages around 50 were when his adrenaline rush was capped and he had 90% DR.
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<snip>
This is a great example of exactly HOW strong avengers really are right now. Ranged they are hands down the best weapon bar non sides rocket launchers.
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Most of the time I am against nerfing but FUCKING AVENGER is to strong Kilgore. You cant play 1hex game if you have gatling vs avenger.
most of time gatling deal 220-250 dmg vs ca mk2 and avenger 270-400 vs 2xtoughness ca mk2
yesterday i 1hexed few bbs and at 3rd time when i 1hexed another bbs for 260dmg he shooted me back for 370 (without crit) even if i had +1/5% from adrenline rush. Now tell me Kilgore if fucking avenger can kill tank with single shoot it is balanced or not? Before buff and in 2238 avenger needed most of time 2 1hex burst to kill 286hp 2x toughness tank, snce update av with bonus with 3xbrd can kill everyone except 2xtoughnes/psycho/beer 286hp ca mk2 tank. Gatling at this stage is piece of crap. Nerf av -2dmg from single bullet because it is op. In MY opinnion only vindicator should give you oportunity to kill with single 1hex burst.
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Most of the time I am against nerfing but FUCKING AVENGER is to strong Kilgore. You cant play 1hex game if you have gatling vs avenger.
most of time gatling deal 220-250 dmg vs ca mk2 and avenger 270-400 vs 2xtoughness ca mk2
yesterday i 1hexed few bbs and at 3rd time when i 1hexed another bbs for 260dmg he shooted me back for 370 (without crit) even if i had +1/5% from adrenline rush. Now tell me Kilgore if fucking avenger can kill tank with single shoot it is balanced or not? Before buff and in 2238 avenger needed most of time 2 1hex burst to kill 286hp 2x toughness tank, snce update av with bonus with 3xbrd can kill everyone except 2xtoughnes/psycho/beer 286hp ca mk2 tank. Gatling at this stage is piece of crap. Nerf av -2dmg from single bullet because it is op. In MY opinnion only vindicator should give you oportunity to kill with single 1hex burst.
If is it so strong use it then.You will become the OP guy onehexkilling everyone with one burst no need to cry.
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I know BBS love avengers but if we compare 2238 and reloaded avengers got 25-50% kick (ap reduction, crits, range, 25% min/max). This is silly how game is focused on avengers bursters. Even if can 1hex 90% of bbs before they 1hex me i will lose vs avenger burster. yesterday den:
I 1hexed 3bbs but and 3rd he shoot me back for 371 dmg.
in last sesion of 2238 avenger could shoot you for 150-170dmg only if you
if you dont see it, you can always say "stop crying noob"
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Jacky leave jet alone ok ?
Pics or didn't happen. Because with what you say i never get hexed for that amount for non critical hit.
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I didnt do screen, but you can trust me it happen in DEN ruins. I dont want to cry about avenger but it is fucking unbalanced now even if I am lvling 3xbrd burster with fast shoot.
regular avenger is acceptable (still to strong) but with bonuses is fucking op.
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I don't trust you.
Again pic or didn't happen
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If is it so strong use it then.You will become the OP guy onehexkilling everyone with one burst no need to cry.
I am using the Avenger Minigun. It is in my opinion, a bit too strong. Just a tiny bit, though.
I don't trust you.
Again pic or didn't happen
20% chance to crit 3xbrd avenger v.s. 2x toughness, psycho, beer, CA mk2 (each armor fresh and above 80%, each time)
(http://gyazo.com/2afcec3b09daa156e1ce2ba6f6ee57d7.png)
Most likely scenario: 60% of the bullets in the burst that hit jacky crit, thus, the message was played out as a non-crit.
Regardless, here are some numbers for you (It's still weaker than a crit BRD XL 1-hex.)
Solution: The only way to not get 1-hexed for 300 is to be ungodly lucky and defy all rolls, praying that his gun critically misses and explodes and he misses his next three turns, or stay below 50% health with adrenaline rush. In which case... you still die.
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And thats is distance shot :P?
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for me it should look like this
range:
minigun<lsw<m60<avenger<bozar<vindicator
1hex:
lsw<minigun<m60<bozar<avenger<vindicator
at this moment it is:
BG < avenger < avenger +bonus dmg
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And thats is distance shot :P?
Please do not respond to posts in English if you cannot follow the flow of a discussion that is in English. What you are doing is in no way constructive to the discussion.
Most of the time I am against nerfing but FUCKING AVENGER is to strong Kilgore. You cant play 1hex game if you have gatling vs avenger.
most of time gatling deal 220-250 dmg vs ca mk2 and avenger 270-400 vs 2xtoughness ca mk2
yesterday i 1hexed few bbs and at 3rd time when i 1hexedanother bbs for 260dmg he shooted me back for 370 (without crit) even if i had +1/5% from adrenline rush. Now tell me Kilgore if fucking avenger can kill tank with single shoot it is balanced or not? Before buff and in 2238 avenger needed most of time 2 1hex burst to kill 286hp 2x toughness tank, snce update av with bonus with 3xbrd can kill everyone except 2xtoughnes/psycho/beer 286hp ca mk2 tank. Gatling at this stage is piece of crap. Nerf av -2dmg from single bullet because it is op. In MY opinnion only vindicator should give you oportunity to kill with single 1hex burst.
I know BBS love avengers but if we compare 2238 and reloaded avengers got 25-50% kick (ap reduction, crits, range, 25% min/max). This is silly how game is focused on avengers bursters. Even if can 1hex 90% of bbs before they 1hex me i will lose vs avenger burster. yesterday den:
I 1hexed 3bbs but and 3rd he shoot me back for 371 dmg.
Most likely scenario: 60% of the bullets in the burst that hit jacky crit, thus, the message was played out as a non-crit.
Regardless, here are some numbers for you (It's still weaker than a crit BRD XL 1-hex.)
Solution: The only way to not get 1-hexed for 300 is to be ungodly lucky and defy all rolls, praying that his gun critically misses and explodes and he misses his next three turns, or stay below 50% health with adrenaline rush. In which case... you still die.
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Uh maybe in other way.
Why one hex shouldn't be devastating ?
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Jacky was complaining about the one-hex damage. Pictures were requested. I provided pictures.
I don't trust you.
Again pic or didn't happen
Edit: I must say though, I've talked to a few people who have wielded light machineguns in the military, and they have all reported that it's going to be a lot harder to hit a guy who is running around within 10 meters than it is at 100 meters.
I don't think people realize how clunky these weapons are.
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Sorry then my fault i though he talk about power of Avenger in all not only one hexs. And strange because i don't get that one hexs from avengers huh, probably mos fault.
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That is more than likely related to build. I'm not one to brag often, but I'm very happy with my BG crit build. Unfortunately, I'm still rooting for an adjustment to lower avenger damage.
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I think good idea is to wait till implants will be ingame, 40 more hp and small boost to dr/dt can be quite "balancing"
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i think you miss something. avengers are very easy to get and you to balance it i need 3implants? 2x 20hp and 1normal treshold which arent in game and not easy to get? maby add to this we have HPA so simply crafted avenger can be easy to get?
so if someone doesnt have 3x implants and HPA or BA we have no chance vs avenger with bonus dmg?
I tested efficient of gatling vs ca mk2 and 1ew implant and 1 hp implant and you know what? gatling was pure shit. To kill him i needed 5-6bursts. When implants will be in game only avengers will deal huge damage.
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Everything is ease to get, then scrap that argument.
Kinda strange that pure pvp build can kill something in 2-3 attacks damn thats imba nerf it!
Gatling =/= avenger.
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Everything is ease to get, then scrap that argument.
Kinda strange that pure pvp build can kill something in 2-3 attacks damn thats imba nerf it!
Gatling =/= avenger.
100% agree
quit yer bitching pls - avenger and galtings are good, both deadly if builded for.
all sg sneakers cry bout vengers
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Everything is ease to get, then scrap that argument.
Kinda strange that pure pvp build can kill something in 2-3 attacks damn thats imba nerf it!
Gatling =/= avenger.
100% agree
quit yer bitching pls - avenger and galtings are good, both deadly if builded for.
all sg sneakers cry bout vengers
Why would sneakers care about avengers?
Everyone else cares far more than the sneaker who isn't getting hit.
The current "Nerf" to avengers equals about 9 damage off the end total, it's absolutely nothing. They're still beyond the best weapon by far.
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You srsly don't know how much that 1-1 less damage make difference ingame.
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(http://static1.fjcdn.com/comments/Have+some+cream+_33b32b25e3e579547829796a9fbfaec2.jpg)
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I am happy of this update. I know gatling =/= avengers but they Have to be in reasonable balance. Now it is ok and you can take 1hex and not die from single burst -300hp
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but you can still die in 1 burst from xl burster.... so...?
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not if you are 2xtoughness ca mk2 286hp tank. if you have psyho and beer you need 2-31hex bursts
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You srsly don't know how much that 1-1 less damage make difference ingame.
You mean 14 damage?
I am happy of this update. I know gatling =/= avengers but they Have to be in reasonable balance. Now it is ok and you can take 1hex and not die from single burst -300hp
You do know a properly geared Avenger still deals close to 250 damage at a RANGE right? Not even 1hex?
(http://i.snag.gy/2To0I.jpg)
This is me, in brotherhood armor, in hinkley. 8 / 40% DR against non modded Avenger
Throw some crits, increased damage and -ap on that avenger and you're dealing 300 to every player you meet, at a range, no problem.
Technically without DR, an Avenger + BRD perks is dealing what, 400 damage a burst at range?
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Technically without DR
Technically keep avenger on >35 hex distance without dr =\
I obvously see problems with your build or gameplay if you still complaining about that.( 8 / 40% DR , no comment)
And yes, -1 dmg to avnger = -40 dmg on hex. It's quite a lot.
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Instead of bitching and moaning you should all be grateful that somebody is listening and that Kilgore is doing an excellent job with keeping this stuff in check while introducing reasonable changes. Most retail games take at least a few months for a balance patch to arrive, I hope that now that weapons like XL, Avenger, RL and Sniper Rifle have been adjusted to be fun yet not blatantly OP he'll just go into "not giving a damn mode," cause somebody's always going to whine or have an excellent fucking idea that requires doing all the tedious balance work all over again because nerfing a single top tier weapon out of viability requires every other top tier weapon to be adjusted accordingly. I mean have you even paused to think and appreciate what we have right now? Is anything blatantly fucking broken? How many of the 40 people taking part in TC are carrying the weapon that causes you butthurt? Is this an actual problem, or just a flavor of the month issue that will become obsolete once somebody figures out a new build or two? Cause I haven't seen 100% XL, 100% Gatling or 100% Avenger team compositions stomping everyone's shit yet.
Oh wait, most of you probably haven't even considered that ::)
Right now gimmick shit like shotguns and pistols is in need of a rework to make it usable (doesn't mean TC-viable), add some single-shot EW adjustments and we're basically done here cause every weapon class will be represented in PvP.
Anyway, the fact that the current XL is getting so much hate simply goes on to show how clueless some people are. It's the first time an assault rifle actually became useful in the history of 2238 (that is since 2009), it's far from being used by every single combatant (20% tops) - and instead of saying "thank you for an amazing, new, useful gun with two fun firing modes that really enhance my SG experience" you're all like "FUCK NO FUDDYFIVE ROUND MAGAZINES WAAARGH NURF NURF IT'S ALMOST AN AVENGER THIS CAN'T BE HAPPENING." Truly pathetic stuff.
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So true, just deal with it, and stop.
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250in range?;) maby u had ba in your pocket and he used jhp :) you were 1hexed and 8/40 is crap. Use 2x toughness build to Have 13/55%
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Technically without DR
Technically keep avenger on >35 hex distance without dr =\
I obvously see problems with your build or gameplay if you still complaining about that.( 8 / 40% DR , no comment)
And yes, -1 dmg to avnger = -40 dmg on hex. It's quite a lot.
But damage was never the problem 1hex, i mean sure it deals a huge amount but letting an avenger get within 1hex in TC is rare at best.
I agree 40 damage is a change if every bullet hits, but a nerf to 1hex isn't really what this thread was about.
I mean have you even paused to think and appreciate what we have right now? Is anything blatantly fucking broken? How many of the 40 people taking part in TC are carrying the weapon that causes you butthurt?
We were observing some fights between BBS and TTTLA today (or whatever factions they were). It was pretty much a big skirmish with everyone using Avengers and Rocket launchers.
I mean that was actually all they were using, maybe 5 out of the 40 players actively fighting in that zone had different builds or specs and weren't using big-guns.
So true, just deal with it, and stop.
Its blatantly obvious you use an Avenger or rocket launcher and just want this thread to go away. If you don't want them to be nerfed then contribute and tell us why it's a balanced weapon at the range and power it has now.
250in range?;) maby u had ba in your pocket and he used jhp :) you were 1hexed and 8/40 is crap. Use 2x toughness build to Have 13/55%
Should i be embarassed for you that it seems in every thread discussing the avenger and its damage output people consistently claim the avenger doesn't deal 200 damage at range?
Does nobody get BRD perks? Or actually get enough strength to make sure all the bullets hit? Do all the avengers you meet have 1 str cookie cutter builds?
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bluepanda, better stop posting. Rocket launchers, avengers, gatlings, sniper rifles, plasma rifles, laser rifles, xl + (gauss pistols, tubo plasma) are only tc weapons and you wont change it. Go and play with your shotgun somewhere else. if you want you can use 14mm pistol or smg or mega power fist in your "tc".
I can see few reason of your "soft BG butthurt":
-you have soft non pvp build
-you use have shity hybrid perks thrower/crit/spammer/gamber/sniper
-you dont know how you should fight in tc
-when you loose 120hp you think bg are op
-you have lack of pvp/tc experience
-your team is loosing
-you are dieing as first
p
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We were observing some fights between BBS and TTTLA today (or whatever factions they were). It was pretty much a big skirmish with everyone using Avengers and Rocket launchers.
Well Killgore has been observing those fights since day 1. Are you implying that you have a better idea what team compositions are we using than us and the only person that watches those fights with GM-vision?
I mean Jesus Christ, multi-weapon builds have surfaced about a week ago (another fun thing that happened for the first time in this game's rather long history), traps shenanigans are becoming somewhat popular without the dumb-ass suicide bomber runs and you're talking how it's a one gun contest now.
Seriously, just stop it.
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Well Killgore has been observing those fights since day 1. Are you implying that you have a better idea what team compositions are we using than us and the only person that watches those fights with GM-vision?
Kilgore was there. He knows.
your "tc".
Just watched a fight at Modoc, was Avengers, Snipers and Rocket Launchers.
There's also that entire sneaker meta going on, but that really never changes the big fights too much, just scouting.