[Wipe] Tank nerf

[Sperber]

I think tanks need a nerf.
You only need to look at the HP of any pvp build to see why.

I'm not really sure how though.
Maybe invert Lifegivers from 20-30-40 to 40-30-20,
so non-tanks profit a little more from only taking one.

Also I think Even Tougher should require Toughness,
so tanks can't just skip Toughness to take Stonewall instead.

[Strike]

Also I think Even Tougher should require Toughness,
so tanks can't just skip Toughness to take Stonewall instead.

I agree, Even Tougher seem to be like next stage of Toughness. Why you would able to choose it without taking Toughness first?

[mojuk]

I'm not really sure how though.
Maybe invert Lifegivers from 20-30-40 to 40-30-20,
so non-tanks profit a little more from only taking one.

That's not a tanks nerf. Tanks will still take 3x lifegiver and for paper characters +20 hp is nothing especially with what you suggested next = no even tougher perk for them.

Also I think Even Tougher should require Toughness,
so tanks can't just skip Toughness to take Stonewall instead.

That's tanks buff because every other char will be weaker not tanks who take both those perks anyway. Also they don't pick stonwall instead of toughness on lvl 6 perk since stonwall is lvl 9 perk.

[Gimper]

Most Full-Tanks take adrenaline rush, toughness and even tougher. I think only a few take stonewall. I could be mistaken, but I only ever take those three perks.

For the inverted lifegivers, it is a good idea; not to nerf tanks, but to buff every other build. +1 on that.

[BurstDeath]

I think tanks need a nerf.
You only need to look at the HP of any pvp build to see why.

I'm not really sure how though.
Maybe invert Lifegivers from 20-30-40 to 40-30-20,
so non-tanks profit a little more from only taking one.

Also I think Even Tougher should require Toughness,
so tanks can't just skip Toughness to take Stonewall instead.

This is nerf but not that "class" what you want, it will only make tank more op like others told it already
Btw Gimper, why you changed Your image to this... ugh...? ;p

[Gimper]

This is nerf but not that "class" what you want, it will only make tank more op like others told it already
Btw Gimper, why you changed Your image to this... ugh...? ;p

How will it make them more OP? Please explain. And btw, I changed it because I'm FABULOUS.

[Sperber]

That's not a tanks nerf. Tanks will still take 3x lifegiver and for paper characters +20 hp is nothing.

20 is better than 0.

That's tanks buff because every other char will be weaker not tanks who take both those perks anyway. Also they don't pick stonwall instead of toughness on lvl 6 perk since stonewall is lvl 9 perk.

Yeah, tanks take tougness anyways, I forgot, since I never made a full tank.
Maybe Even Tougher should only give 5% DR but that doesn't seem right either.
Like I said, I'm not sure how nerf them properly ...

All I can say is that tanks are too strong and it's probably easier to nerf tanks than to buff every other build.

[Wind_Drift]

Nerfing something isn't going to solve anything, it never does. People will always use the most OP build they can find, unless they're a moron like me, and prefer paper characters.

Someone once suggested making Lifegivers an even 30 HP per level, which makes sense to me.  If Lifegivers, toughness, and other tank perks were available to paper characters, maybe things would be a bit different... except paper characters would still die easily., regardless.

[Rothbard]

Lifegiver should definitely be 30, 30, 30. I don't think tanks need nerfed, instead non-tanks need buffed. I think a lot of balance could be accomplished in this area by reworking the way Armor Class works in order to benefit non-tanks.

[duh7]

What u think on support perk livegiver.
All players can pick them not only tanks so other classes can survive burst but not be a rly tanky.

[Kilgore]

"Nerfing tanks" is so obvious that it doesn't need to be suggested. It's planned already.